Hired Killer

Legend of the Five Rings card from Samurai Edition, Lotus Edition, Tomorrow, Celestial Edition 15th Anniversary, Shattered Empire, Three Dynasties, Promotional–Samurai

Card Type

Strategy

Gold Cost

*

Card Text

Limited: Pay Gold equal to a target Personality's unit's total Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy the Personality.

Focus Value

3

Legality

Age of Enlightenment (Lotus), Race for the Throne (Samurai), Shattered Empire, Three Dynasties

Deck

Fate

Printings

Rulings

• Erratum: Reads, "Hired Killer *G 3FV Limited: Pay Gold equal to the target’s unit’s total Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy a target Personality." [MRP, Samurai Edition, 25 July 2007] Comprehensive Rules, Samurai Edition, with specific card rulings, final version, May 2009, p. 138
• If the basis for Hired Killer's cost is interfered with (e.g. Misdirection, Seat of Power) or changed (e.g. Kumade) between announcement and paying its cost, you may choose to not pay its cost and have it fail (see XI.2.3 C. Pay costs). Comprehensive Rules, Samurai Edition, with specific card rulings, final version, May 2009, p. 138

Rules Q&A

• Q: Sir can i ask about this question regarding hired killer and determination.The enemy have a Suitengu's Surge he use it to survive in hired killer but a play determination.Regarding of the ruling of this can you verify what is right action for this.
  A: Determination prevents negation of the Hired Killer.
  However, Suitengu's Surge doesn't negate Hired Killer, it removes the target from play so that when the effects of Hired Killer activate, they can't affect it.
  So, Suitengu's Surge will still stop Hired Killer, even if you played Determination with it. Brook Cunningham, "Hired Killer + Determination vs Suitengu's Surge", 9 Apr 2011
• Q: If an Action, like Hired Killer, explicitly destroys a personality (not the unit), are the personalities attachements considered to be destroyed by the action or by a rulebook effect?
  Title Hired Killer Text Limited: Pay Gold equal to the target’s unit’s Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy a target Personality.
  A: By a rulebook effect.
  See Attachments: When a Personality leaves play, all his attached cards leave play in the same manner as he did. This leaving play is a rulebook effect contingent on the effect that took the Personality out of play, so the attachments are destroyed "for" (as a consequence of) the original effect, but not "by" the original effect. Alex Jones, "Destruction, Action, Unit", 22 Dec 2009
• Q: Hey All, I tried searching for an answer to this, but was unable to determine an answer.
  Scenario - Player B's Limited Phase - Player A has a Pekkle no Oni and an honorable samurai in play, Player B has Samarhad Exp. in play. 1. Player B uses Samarhad to take Pekkle no Oni from Player A. 2. Player A passes 3. Player B plays Hired Killer, paying 5 gold, to destroy Pekkle no Oni
  Question: 1. Who looses the 10 honor from Pekkle no Oni? 2. Can Player A react with Duty to negate the destruction?
  Thanks!
  Pekkle no Oni: Oni • Nonhuman • Shadowlands • Supai After the first time each turn Pekkle enters play: Gain 3 Honor. After Pekkle is destroyed: Lose 10 Honor. Political Limited: Bow Pekkle: Gain 1 Honor.
  Samarhad: Ratling • Nonhuman • Ashalan • Sun-Rider • Experienced • Unique Open: Bow Samarhad: Take control of a target Personality without his controller's Clan alignment. Straighten him. At the end of the turn, if he is not Ratling, return control of him to the player you took him from.
  Hired Killer: Limited: Pay Gold equal to the target’s unit’s Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy a target Personality.
  Duty: Bushido Virtue Reaction: Before another player’s card’s effect destroys one of your Personalities, destroy one of your honorable Samurai Personalities at the same location: Negate the first Personality’s destruction.
  A: The owner of Pekkle no Oni loses 10 honor if Pekkle no Oni is destroyed.
  Player A cannot react with Duty, as "your" in the case of Duty implies "a Personality under your control"
  EDIT: Corrected. Dan Jacobson, "Samarhad vs. Pekkle and Duty", 11 May 2009
• Q: A player annonce a action witch could destroy (e.g. Hired Killer) on one of my personnalities, and I play Spin the Kharmic Wheel as a reaction. Is the effect of Hired Killer considered negated by Spin the Kharmic Wheel's?
  A: http://rules.l5r.com/Glossary_I-J#Instead: "The substitution of Y for X is not a negation of X." Zen Faulkes, "Spin the Kharmic Wheel and negation.", 19 Apr 2009
• Q: Can I use Shinjo Technique (Reaction: Play when another player targets one of your personalities with an action card. Redirect the action to one of that player's Personalities, if a legal target is available) to redirect Hired Killer(Limited: Pay Gold equal to the target’s unit’s Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy a target Personality)?
  Do I then have to pay the new target's gold cost?
  A: This question has been asked before. Frequently, in fact.
  http://rules.l5r.com/FAQ#What_happens_i ... nt_cost.3F Zen Faulkes, "Shinjo Technique & Hired Killer", 18 Mar 2009
• Q: My opponent destroys Pekkle no Oni, for example, with a Hired Killer. Can I react with Imperial Command for avoid the honor loss?
  A: No. Pekkle No Oni's trait will kick in before the Reaction can be played. Traits and Reactions are E and F on this list, respectively: http://rules.l5r.com/Timing#Resolving_timing_conflicts Zen Faulkes, "Pekkle no oni + Imperial Command", 18 Mar 2009
• Q: In reference to viewtopic.php?f=59&t=73294#p959588 and Hired Killer hitting a new target.
  If I redirect a Hired Killer to a personality with the same cost, does the cost have to be paid as the costs weren't modified?
  Thanks,
  A: Even if the new target has the same cost, Hired Killer's player may choose not to pay it.
  The rule is:
  "Sometimes an action, trait or card has a mandatory variable cost, which depends on an element of the game that another players' effect interferes with at some point between announcement and the point when the cost is paid. Example: A Gold cost depends on the total Gold cost of a target unit. After announcement but before costs are paid, a card is added to the unit or the targeting of the unit is changed.
  When such a basis for a variable cost changes due to interference, this is treated the same way as interference with the payment of the cost."
  Note that the Rule only cares if the basis changes (i.e via Shosuro Aroru Exp) or is interfered with (i.e. via Misdirection). It doesn't care if the end result from the new basis is the same or different. Brook Cunningham, "Hired Killer + Changing Targets", 15 Jan 2009
• Q: In reference to THIS :
  Does this mean that they still have to pay the initial cost (eg. for Aroru, paying 10), and then if this is directed to a more expensive personality, and the person who played Hired Killer chooses not to pay the increased cost, that 10 gold is still paid, or does the change of target happen before the gold is spent?
  A: It means:
  No effects of the action resolve; The ability is considered to have been used; The action is considered to have been taken, but not resolved; No remaining costs need be paid, but costs already paid are not refunded. If the cost was for a card to enter play, it is discarded.
  And that's because of the last line: When such a basis for a variable cost changes due to interference, this is treated the same way as interference with the payment of the cost. Zen Faulkes, "Hired Killer + Changing Targets", 15 Jan 2009
• Q: Now, do I have to pay the new cost of the action if I am able? Or can I choose not to and just lose my Hired Killer?
  A: You can choose not to pay the new cost.
  http://rules.l5r.com/Abilities_and_actions#C._Pay_costs (emphases mine):
  "From the point when the action is announced legally to the point where the costs are required, if payment of an action’s mandatory costs is interfered with, and the player taking the action cannot pay the costs another way, or chooses not to:
  No effects of the action resolve; The ability is considered to have been used; The action is considered to have been taken, but not resolved; No remaining costs need be paid, but costs already paid are not refunded. If the cost was for a card to enter play, it is discarded.
  Note that if a cost requiring a target is interfered with, a player cannot choose a new target to try to pay the cost, because the targeting step is already completed.
  Sometimes an action, trait or card has a mandatory variable cost, which depends on an element of the game that another players' effect interferes with at some point between announcement and the point when the cost is paid. Example: A Gold cost depends on the total Gold cost of a target unit. After announcement but before costs are paid, a card is added to the unit or the targeting of the unit is changed.
  When such a basis for a variable cost changes due to interference, this is treated the same way as interference with the payment of the cost." Brook Cunningham, "Hired Killer + Changing Targets", 15 Jan 2009
• Q: I am unclear about how this changes things. If I play a Hired Killer, and my opponent changes my targetting to a a) more expensive unit or b) less expensive unit, what happens under this errata?
  A: As stated, it's treat the same way as if cost payment was interfered with. It's immediately above the new section in the wiki (http://rules.l5r.com/Costs_and_restrict ... tory_costs).
  "If, due to interference from other effects, a mandatory cost cannot be paid at the point when it must be paid:
  "No remaining costs need be paid, but costs already paid are not refunded.
  "No effects of the action or trait resolve, and the ability or trait is considered to have been “used.”
  "If the cost was for a card to enter play, it is discarded."
  Actually, I see a similar list at http://rules.l5r.com/Abilities_and_actions#C._Pay_costs. We'll be checking those to make sure the two are exactly parallel, so don't be surprised if one or the other has changed a little by the time you read it. Zen Faulkes, "Payment errata", 25 Nov 2008
• Q: If one player wants to kill another player's Bayushi Paneki xp4 with Hired Killer, does Paneki's trait trigger?
  Does he lose 3 Honor from Hired Killer or 4 (Hired Killer + Paneki's trait)?
  A: Bayushi Paneki exp4: After another player’s action resolves that targeted one or more Personalities at Paneki’s location: The player loses 1 Honor.
  After Hired Killer resolves, Paneki is in the discard pile and out of play, so his trait does not trigger. See Implications of in and out of play: Cards that are not in play or in a resolution, entering-play or focusing area have the following limitations: Abilities on them cannot be used, and triggered traits on them are not triggered. Alex Jones, "Bayushi Paneki xp4 vs Hired Killer", 30 Oct 2008
• Q: Code: Select all Once an action or triggered trait starts, apply all its costs, targeting, and effects in sequence before proceeding, even if another action or triggered trait is under way.
  The above is from the Comprehensive Rules on timing. Shouldn't the sequence be Targeting then costs? Since some actions have variable costs dependent on targeting, how could one pay said costs without having selected its targets? The rulings on Hired Killer seem to bear this out.
  A: Well, that sentence you quote isn't deliniating the proper sequence; it's just a list. This is the section that does:
  http://rules.l5r.com/Abilities_and_actions#Using_abilities
  While the sentece could have listed those steps in their sequential order, it's no less accurate than saying: "Address each preschooler, baby, and teenager in order of youngest to oldest." Brook Cunningham, "Timing question from the Comprehensive Rules", 22 Sep 2008
• Q: A little more on the Michio Xp. + Determination.
  What would happen in the following situation. I have a Hired Killer and I want to make sure it goes through. I target my bowed samurai. The samurai has now proformed an action and is now a legal target for Michio's reaction. Does Determination now guard Michio's reaction or the next action that I perform (ie Hired Killer)? In other words, bowed samurai + Determination + Michio Xp is legal as long as I don't pass priority and perform an action?
  Thanks!
  A: As described, you are playing Determination in response to Hired Killer.
  To get Determination to affect the Experienced Michio's ability (which is possible), Michio would need to be responding to some other action. Or you would need a second Determination: one for Hired Killer, one for Michio. It would look roughly like:
  Determination #1 played in anticipation of Hired Killer.
  Personality targeted, providing trigger for Michio (Exp.).
  Determination #2 played in anticipation of the ability of Michio (Exp.).
  Experienced Michio's ability resolves, affected by Determination #2.
  Hired Killer resolves, affected by Determination #1. Zen Faulkes, "Determination + Michio XP", 17 Sep 2008
• Q: Pekkle no Oni has the trait: 'After Pekkle is destroyed: Lose 10 Honor.' Determination's text: Dark Virtue Reaction: Before you announce an action, target one of your Samurai: The action can not have its effects negated or have its targeting changed. After the action destroys any Personality, remove him from the game.
  My opponent uses Hired Killer to destroy my Pekkle no Oni and wanting to be sure plays Determination as a Reaction to it. There are two effects that trigger after Pekkle's destruction: removing Pekkle from the game and me losing 10 Honor.
  1. Which of these effects occur first? 2. If Pekkle is removed from the game before the Honor loss, will the Honor loss trigger?
  Thank you!
  A: Timing: If two or more reactions, triggered traits, or rules procedures are triggered at the same point in time, follow this sequence from A through F to resolve their order. D. Apply any delayed effects or indefinite conditional effects that resolved previously and are timed to the trigger (such as, “After the next time this turn he assigns…” or "After each time this turn a Personality assigns...") E. Apply any triggered traits on cards.
  Determination creates a delayed effect that removes the Personality from the game and so falls under D. Pekkle's trait is a triggered trait and so falls under E.
  Pekkle no Oni is removed from the game before you lose 10 honour. Alex Jones, "Pekkle no Oni + Determination", 12 Aug 2008
• Q: If I use determination when I play The Last One and then my opponent plays a Hired Killer with a determination against my personality targeted with The Last One what will happen?
  A: http://www.alderac.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=65480&p=841444
  As per Marty's second bit of "Determination Math" in the above link, Determination + Negation action (The Last One, in this case) trumps Determination + regular action. The Hired Killer player would need to use two Determinations to overcome your own Determination PLUS The Last One's own negation. Basically, whoever has the most negation wins. Brook Cunningham, "Determination and The Last One", 24 May 2008
• Q: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=67920
  viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61715&p=789676
  viewtopic.php?f=59&t=67829&p=873928&hilit=Hida+Sozen#p873928
  using these as references... An action ends after its last effect is applied, if that effect is not a delayed effect. If an action's last effect is delayed, then the action ends instead after that effect is activated. However, An action resolves even if all its effects are negated or otherwise do not occur. Effects of an action are independent. If any effect is negated, does not happen, or fails to occur (for example, bowing an already bowed Personality, or moving him to a location he was already in), the other effects still happen, and the action is still legal EXCEPTION: Some effects may be delayed (see Delayed effects) and are applied at a later time in the game than they resolve.
  A delayed effect is activated at one time, but is actually applied at another. Such delayed effects are still said to “resolve” when they are first activated, but are actually applied at a future time. A delayed effect that has been activated, but not yet applied, can still be negated by something that negates effects in general, such as "all effects from other players' cards." However, something that negates a specific type of effect, such as bowing, will only negate a delayed effect when it is actually applied.
  Player A plays Determination and Announces Hired Killer, the Action Resolves and Hida Sozen is about to be Destroyed (and thus, removed from the game via Determination) but Player B delays the Death with Razor of the Dawn.
  from my understanding of the rules the Result is... Determination activates and Resolves "even if all its effects are negated or otherwise do not occur." Hired Killer Activates and Resolves, with its effect applied at a Future Time. At the end of the turn, the destruction effect is applied but negated by Hida Sozens ability.
  since Determination does not have an Ongoing effect (no While, Permanent or Until trigger) or an Continuous effects (due to the trigger "After") it no longer interferes with Sozen's ability to negate the death.
  A: Determination applies to all its action's effects: immediate, delayed and ongoing.
  At the end of the turn, Hida Sozen dies and is removed from the game. Alex Jones, "determination vs Hida Sozen + delay destruction", 8 May 2008
• Q: Hired Killer does not cause a Spider's Lair player to lose honor. Lies Lies Lies does not care if an honor loss effect exists, as printed it is concerned with cards that cause their player an honor loss. Lies Lies Lies should be legal for a Spider's Lair player to announce as long as they have no shadowlands, ninja, kolat, or non-spider clan dynasty honor loss cards in play or discard piles.
  A: No, Chris.
  "Lies, Lies, Lies ..." looks for cards which "cause their player an honor loss" as part of their own effects.
  It is limited specifically to the text of the card in question. "Their player," specifies that the card cause the player who plays the card to be the one taking the Honor Loss, not another player. That descriptor distinguishes a card such as Hired Killer ("causes their player an honor loss") from a card such as Assigning Blame ("causes an honor loss") - nothing else.
  We don't take the trait of a Spider Stronghold into consideration when looking for a "card that causes their player an honor loss" any more than we take a card that says your actions have "an additional cost," or your duels have "an additional result." Additive or subtractive modifications of an Action's base effects are EXACTLY why we don't have "Smart Cards."
  You still can't play "Lies, Lies, Lies ..." if you have a card in your Discard Pile with the trait "Lose 3 honor," an ability with an Honor loss cost, or an ability with an effect that says "Lose 3 honor," like Hired Killer - regardless of whether or not your Stronghold allows you to lose honor. Martin Lund, "Lies, Lies, Lies... + Spider's Lair", 1 May 2008
• Q: regarding this viewtopic.php?f=59&t=67288
  can't you not few against many your own duty since the personality is being destroyed by your own card effect (the duty) and not by your opponent's action?
  A: It is true that you couldn't play Few Against Many to prevent B's destruction, for two reasons:
  1. Duty isn't "another player's card". 2. The destruction is a cost, not an effect.
  However, even if you used an action that didn't care about these things (eg, Ikoma Yasuko's Reaction), you would then be failing to pay the cost of Duty, so personality A would be destroyed. Alex Jones, "Hired Killer vs. Duty/Few Against Many", 18 Apr 2008
• Q: If I play Hired Killer against personality A (who has no followers), can my opponent play Duty, to kill personality B instead (who does have followers) and then react with Few Against Many to stop the destruction? Does personality B need to die for Duty to work (his destruction comes before the colen)? Can player B Few Against Many in this situation? Is it Duty killing personality B (his own card effect, making Few Against Many unuseable) or is it the Hired Killer killing personality B (making it usable)? Thank you.
  Hired Killer: Limited: Pay Gold equal to the target’s unit’s Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy a target Personality.
  Duty: Bushido Virtue Reaction: Before another player’s card’s effect destroys one of your Personalities, destroy one of your honorable Samurai Personalities at the same location: Negate the first Personality’s destruction.
  Few Against Many: Reaction: Before another player’s card’s effect destroys one of your Personalities, bow one of his Followers: Negate the Personality’s destruction.
  A: If you Few Against Many your Duty, the Duty's effects are negated as you never paid the cost of Duty.
  Hired Killer in this situation is irrelevant as it doesn't matter how your personality died. Doruk Özaydın, "Hired Killer vs. Duty/Few Against Many", 18 Apr 2008
• Q: I kill another player's personality with a Hired Killer, reacting with a copy of Determination to its anouncement. The other player also has a copy of Shosuro Adeiko in play. According the pre-errata text of her reaction, can she react to it after the Hired Killer is resolved?
  A: Yes. The Personality hits the discard pile. Further, whether or not its in the game does not change that a card was, in fact, destroyed. Zen Faulkes, "Determination vs. old Adeiko", 24 Mar 2008
• Q: Would that Hired Killer cost 2 less gold because the Diplomatic Apprentice was attached to a scorpion players personality or would it cost 2 less gold because it was a crane player performing the Hired Killer?"
  A: http://rules.l5r.com/Physically_marked_ ... es#Control: "A card’s text (such as, “Lose 3 Honor” or “You can not take Political actions”) is to be read from the perspective of its controller while the card is in play."
  Sorry for missing it. Zen Faulkes, "Hired Killer on a Diplomatic Apprentice", 19 Mar 2008
• Q: An interesting question came up last night, a scorpion player had a Diplomatic Apprentice attached to one of his personalities. A crane player tried to Hired Killer this personality and wanted to claim the 2 gold cost reduction a Diplomatic Apprentice gives scorpion and crane players in the cost of the hired killer. Was he right in this assumption? Would that Hired Killer cost 2 less gold because the Diplomatic Apprentice was attached to a scorpion players personality or would it cost 2 less gold because it was a crane player performing the Hired Killer?
  A: http://rules.l5r.com/Glossary_G: "Gold Cost, when referred to as a card’s stat, is a stat that initially determines the amount of Gold needed to pay to bring the card into play."
  The Diplomatic Apprentice text refers to a Gold Cost stat, so it always applies, not just during attachment.
  (Clarified.) Zen Faulkes, "Hired Killer on a Diplomatic Apprentice", 18 Mar 2008
• Q: I play Hired Killer targeting an opponent's Champion. I react to the Hired Killer with a Determination, and react to the Determination with a Determination. My opponent reacts with Seat of Power(.)
  A: The first player is getting in all the Determinations before the second. I agree that there is a little vagueness in "play Hired Killer", which, as I previously said, I took to be an informal description of the process. Zen Faulkes, "Multiple Determinations", 11 Mar 2008
• Q: Regarding this : viewtopic.php?f=59&t=66277
  Well, the play described in the OP post is not correct, as you play determination BEFORE you announce an action (card text) so the sequence of play should be :
  Player A : Determination, Announce Determination and play it (This Determination can now can't have it's effect negated or it's target changed), Announce Hired Killer (this Hired Killer can't have it's effect negated nor it's targeting changed, then the personality it kills will be removed from the Game). Player B : Determination, Announce Seat of Power (can't have it's effect negated, not it's targeting changed). This effect bypass the last determination of player A, and effectiveley Player B can change the target of Hired Killer.
  Is this reasoning incorrect, and why?
  A: I interpreted "I play Hired Killer and react with Determination" as an informal description of the process.
  I believe the summary above describes the first question, but not the second, which added another Determination to the mix. Zen Faulkes, "Multiple Determinations", 10 Mar 2008
• Q: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=66277
  I play Hired Killer targeting an opponent's Champion. I react to the Hired Killer with a Determination, and react to the Determination with a Determination. My opponent reacts with Seat of Power, reacting with Determination. Is the Hired Killer redirected? If my opponent reacted to his Determination with another Determination, would it be redirected?
  Thanks!
  A: He who plays the most Determinations wins (effects are not negated).
  If both players have equal numbers of Determination, last one played wins (effects are not negated). Zen Faulkes, "Multiple Determinations", 10 Mar 2008
• Q: Hired Killer: Limited: Pay Gold equal to the target’s unit’s Gold Cost plus 2: Lose 3 Honor. Destroy a target Personality.
  A: The card says Personality. No matter how much Gold you pay it never says to destroy any attachments.
  Attachments get wiped out when a Personality leaves play due to game rules. If the Personality never leaves play then that game rule never kicks in to sweep away the attachments.
  If you want to destroy all the cards in a unit, independently of the Personality living or dying, you need an effect that says "destroy the target unit," like Ruthless Advance. Martin Lund, "Hired Killer Clarification", 7 Mar 2008
• Q: I have a personality with three followers attached. The personality was targeted by:
  A) Hired Killer B) Ruthless Advance
  If I bow my follower for Few Against Many, will I be able to save my whole unit or just the personality?
  A: "Negate the Personality’s destruction." (Card text, emphasis added.) Zen Faulkes, "Few Against Many", 22 Jan 2008
• Q: First off, let me appologize if this has been asked before (as I can only imagine that it has been) but I couldn't find it anywhere.
  One of our Crab players wanted to know if you could prevent the death that was delayed through Razor of the Dawn Castle with Yasuki Jinn-Kuen. The specific example follows:
  Player A: Hired Killer Hida Bob (Hero). Player B: Uses Razor of the Dawn Castle to Prevent the Death Player B: Yasuki Jinn-Kuen Political Open to negate the destruction of the next death caused by another players card effect. ... turn ends.
  Razor of the Dawn Castle Before another player's card's effect destroys one of your Samurai: Once per turn, you may delay the destruction until the current turn ends.
  Yasuki Jinn-Kuen Political Open: Target one of your Hero Personalities. Before the next time this turn another player's card effect would destroy him, negate the destruction, move him home, and bow him.
  Thanks for your time and your speedy response.
  For the Lion!
  A: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=62504 also applies here. The source of the destruction is not changing, simply being delayed until a later point. Chris Fuchs, "Razor of the Dawn Castle + Yasuki Jinn-Kuen", 15 Oct 2007
• Q: Hi!
  Regarding this:
  viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61970
  Could you please clarify? To whose action are you pertaining? To the Seat of Power or (let's say the action whose target being changed is) Hired Killer?
  Isn't the action (if the target is being changed) on the control of the one taking the action? That is;
  A) I Hired Killer Hida Kuon B) Player B plays Seat of Power and activates the redirection C) (Please clarify if this is correct) Since I'm the one originally playing Hired Killer, and Seat of Power states that I'll have to choose another target, this just means that I can choose any personality with the exception of Hida Kuon?
  Thanks!
  A: The person taking the action on seat of power chooses the new target. Chris Fuchs, "RE: Seat of Power", 24 Sep 2007
• Q: (I)f I target Shosuro Aroru Exp. with a Hired Killer and he redirect it to one of my Personalities must I pay the costs and kill my personality or I can avoid that?
  A: Point: There is no such thing as "redirection" in Samurai Edition rules.
  The Experienced Shosuro Aroru's Reaction is "when" targeting occurs. Hired Killer's cost is set after targeting occurs (http://rules.l5r.com/Rulings_H#Hired_Killer).
  The cost did not change, and you must pay it.
  See also: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61363 viewtopic.php?f=59&t=61353
  Though the timing of Misdirection is earlier, same basic principle is at work. Zen Faulkes, "Shosuro Aroru and costs.", 22 Sep 2007
• Q: (C)an I destroy Sozen exp with, say, Hired Killer, assuming that I also played Determination?
  A: http://rules.l5r.com/Glossary_C#Cannot
  Hida Sozen (Experienced) negates. Yes. Zen Faulkes, "Hida Sozen exp and Determination", 15 Sep 2007
• Q: (W)hich of the following is correct:
  A: This one: Zen Faulkes, "More on Hired Killer and Kumade", 11 Sep 2007
• Q: Player 2 has the option to pay additional gold to meet the increased cost of Hired Killer even if he has enough gold available to pay the increased cost. He does not have to pay anything for the Hired Killer if he decides not to pay the additional cost. If he chooses not to pay the additional cost Hired Killer is discarded.
  A: Kumade is attached after targeting by a Reaction, so that changes the cost of Hired Killer (The gold cost of Hired Killer is also set after targeting occurs -- but Reactions occur last to a given trigger. http://rules.l5r.com/Timing) (Clarified 22 September 2007.) Zen Faulkes, "More on Hired Killer and Kumade", 11 Sep 2007
• Q: Would the situation be the same when using Turn of Fortune to change a target to a more expensive personality?
  A: No. The timing of Turn of Fortune is different. It's not after targeting (unlike Kumade), so it does not change the cost of Hired Killer. Zen Faulkes, "More on Hired Killer and Kumade", 11 Sep 2007
• Q: I have a random personality with 3 random followers, all cards are unbowed. The opponent plays Hired Killer (or any other PK that destroys units such as 7th tower's action or ruthless advance) on the unit, I respond with Few Against Many and bow a follower. The personality is saved but the followers are all destroyed right?
  A: Bad example. Hired Killer card text: "Destroy a target Personality." Not unit.
  Few Against Many: "Negate the Personality’s destruction" (card text). Nothing else. Zen Faulkes, "Few Against Many and unit destruction", 23 Aug 2007
• Q: Is a Variable Gold Cost, such as with Hired Killer or Ruthless Advance, needed to be announced as part of the "Good Faith Rule"?
  A: That is determined based on targeting and has nothing to do with ability announcement. The Good Faith rule still applies to the resulting cost. Chris Fuchs, "Reinforce the Gates Negation of Announcement, pt. duex!", 13 Aug 2007
• Q: Costs must be payable when an action is announced under the Good Faith Rule. If, due to interference from other effects, a mandatory cost cannot be paid at the point when it must be paid:
  * No remaining costs need be paid, but costs already paid are not refunded. * No effects of the action or trait resolve, and the ability or trait is considered to have been “used.” * If the cost was for a card to enter play, it is discarded.
  A: If you get to the Cost Payment step and suddenly you can't pay the Gold Cost because someone bowed one of your Gold Producing Holdings or messed with targeting, you don't have to pay the remaining costs.
  So in this case, if you can't pay enough Gold to kill the target you don't pay any Gold. Martin Lund, "More about Redirecting a Hired Killer", 30 Jul 2007
• Q: 2nd question:
  I wanted to come on the Determination vs Determination subject.
  If I target Hida Kuon with Hired Killer and target one of my samurai to play Determination on the Hired Killer, can my opponent play Determination on Seat of Power's reaction to be able to redirect the Hired Killer even if Determination has been played on it ? Which Determination would beat the other ?
  A: I would be inclined to say the last one to be played would "trump" the other, but I'll forward it up to the entire Rules Team proper to give you the official word on that. Martin Lund, "Misdirection and "up to"/ Determination vs Determination", 30 Jul 2007
• Q: Ok, this is a funny one.
  I control an unbowed Shosuro Aroru XP and my players announces a Hired Killer, targetting one of my ninja (eg Aroru himself). I react with Aroru's ability and choose another target for the action, in fact my opponent's most expensive personality. My opponent can produce enough gold in order to pay the action that now targets his personality.
  Must he pay the gold cost and destroy his personality, or may he choose not to pay the gold cost, making the action fail and thus saving the target?
  A: Targeting, and Aroru's Reaction, happens before costs are paid. The cost is whatever is targeted when costs are being paid. Cost is not set at announcement, or at targeting, or at retargeting. Costs are set when costs are paid. Zen Faulkes, "Redirecting a Hired Killer", 18 Jul 2007
• Q: When someone is targeted by Hired Killer, and the player of the target uses an effect to redirect the Hired Killer, does the new target need precisely the same gold cost, or can a lower-cost unit be a valid target?
  A: viewtopic.php?t=31819
  viewtopic.php?t=36727
  viewtopic.php?t=36756
  Update to some of those posts: The card is discarded, rather than staying in your hand. See Rules Archive, Costs. Zen Faulkes, "Hired Killer", 19 Jun 2007
• Q: If I have Wandering Sohei in play attached to Moshi Amika Basic, a copy of The Path not Taken in the fate discard pile and my opponent discards a Hired Killer, may I use the Sohei's trait to have Amika perform The Path not Taken from the discard pile?
  A: Yes. Zen Faulkes, "Wandering Sohei and The Path not Taken.", 19 Jun 2007
• Q: [ShE] The GC of the personality recruited by the response of this card gets permanently reduced or not? I mean, if a 7 GC personality was recruited by paying 1 GC and I want to use Hired Killer to kill them, do I need to pay 3 GC or 9 GC?
  A: "paying less" does not reduce the GC stat, only what you need to pay Brook Cunningham, "Sun and Moon #rules-questions", 10 Jun 2026