Kitsune Den

Legend of the Five Rings card from Celestial Edition, Samurai Edition, Promotional–Lotus, Three Dynasties

Card Type

Holding

Gold Cost

2

Keywords

Unique

Card Text

w: Produce 2 Gold.
Political Limited: Destroy this Holding to rehonor one or more target dishonorable Personalities and gain Honor equal to the highest printed Personal Honor among them.

Legality

Age of Enlightenment (Lotus), Destroyer War (Celestial), Race for the Throne (Samurai), Three Dynasties

Deck

Dynasty

Printings

Rulings

• Erratum: Reads, "Kitsune Den 2G Unique Bow this card: Produce 2 Gold. Political Limited: Destroy this card: Rehonor one or more target dishonorable Personalities. Gain Honor equal to the highest base Personal Honor among them." [MRP, Celestial Edition, 29 June 2009] Comprehensive Rules, Celestial Edition, with specific card rulings, final version, February 2012, p. 143
• Erratum: Reads, “Kitsune Den Unique Bow this card: Produce 2 Gold. Political Limited: Destroy this card: Rehonor one or more target dishonorable Personalities. Gain Honor equal to the highest base Personal Honor among them.” [MRP, Samurai Edition, 25 July 2007] Comprehensive Rules, Samurai Edition, with specific card rulings, final version, May 2009, p. 142

Rules Q&A

• Q: This ruling: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=90494&p=1201878
  Zen said he was going to kick it to the Rules Junta . . . any word?
  I think the main part of the issue is the wording of the rules are these. At least 3 cards that are affected are A Gentle Word, Kitsune Den, and Unshakable Resolve - all of which rehonor first, then gain honor:
  Physically Marked Card States Dishonorable status is checked when the Personality is targeted, etc.
  References: Dishonorable status is checked only at the time the targeting, origin or performing of the action or trait is established.
  A: Fixed it! Those cards now work as they should within the parameters of the Rules.
  Honorable and Disohonorable status: "Before a player gains Honor from an action or trait that targeted, came from, or was performed by one or more of his or her dishonorable Personalities, if any of those Personalities is not otherwise rehonored by the action or trait, each Personality is rehonored and the player does not gain the Honor. (Dishonorable status is checked when the Personality is targeted, etc. For more details, see References). [CHANGED 2 Aug 2011]" Brook Cunningham, "Unshakable Resolve and Kitsune Den", 1 Aug 2011
• Q: In looking at one of the BtD previews, I had a bit of a head scratching moment:
  Kitsune Den: Political Limited: Destroy this card: Rehonor one or more target dishonorable Personalities. Gain Honor equal to the highest base Personal Honor among them.
  Unshakable Resolve: Open: Rehonor your target dishonorable Personality. While he is opposed this turn, he has a Force bonus equal to his Personal Honor. If his Personal Honor is 4 or greater, gain 1 Honor.
  Rules: The rules for rehonoring Personalities say a Personality is rehonored, "Before a player gains Honor from an action or trait that targeted, came from, or was performed by one or more of his or her dishonorable Personalities, the Personality is rehonored and the player does not gain the Honor." Dishonorable status is checked only at the time the targeting, origin or performing of the action or trait is established.
  The honor gain from both Kitsune Den and Unshakable Resolve comes from an action that targeted one or more dishonorable personalities. The rules say that dishonorable status is checked when the targeting occur, which is before they are rehonored. Technically, doesn't that mean you would gain 0 honor, because the personalities were dishonorable at the time?
  A: Since you mentioned Before the Dawn previews, sorry, not yet on those: viewtopic.php?f=59&t=89812
  That said... in general, note that the rules on rehonoring Personalities (http://rules.l5r.com/CE_Physically_mark ... shonorable) does not include specific card effects. And effects resolve in the order written (http://rules.l5r.com/CE_Effects#Order_of_effects). Zen Faulkes, "Unshakable Resolve and Kitsune Den", 30 Apr 2011
• Q: There are no dishonorable personalities in play (but there are honorable ones). can i still use Unshakable Resolve or Kitsune Den's abilities?
  A: No. Those are mandatory targets.
  http://rules.l5r.com/CE_FAQ#What_are_re ... targets.3F: "All required targeting must be met, including that given in the effects block, to take the action." Zen Faulkes, "Unshakable Resolve and Kitsune Den", 27 Mar 2010
• Q: a question came up in a recent game regarding Unshakable Resolve and Kitsune Den
  setting: there are no dishonorable personalities in play (but there are honorable ones)
  question: can i still use Unshakable Resolve or Kitsune Den's abilities? the targeting part of both cards would fail, ie no dishonorable persons, but would the other parts still occur (ie gain honor or force) or am i wrong (which i suspect i am)? there are no constraint costs (words between colons?) that specify a dishonorable peep, so it makes me unsure what the rule would be.
  Unshakable Resolve Open: Rehonor your target dishonorable Personality. While he is opposed this turn, he has a Force bonus equal to his Personal Honor. If his Personal Honor is 4 or greater, gain 1 Honor.
  Kitsune Den Political Limited: Destroy this card: Rehonor one or more target dishonorable Personalities. Gain Honor equal to the highest base Personal Honor among them.
  thanks for your time
  A: Without dishonorable targets, you cannot legally announce those actions.
  Good Faith Rule (Emphasis Mine): "When an action is announced, the player must be able to target all required targets, meet all conditions of the action, and pay all mandatory costs, to the best of his or her knowledge."
  Required Targeting: "An action’s required targets consist of anything that is targeted by the player taking the action in the action's constraints or effects, using the word “target” or “targets,” unless the targeting is explicitly described as optional." Brook Cunningham, "Unshakable Resolve and Kitsune Den", 27 Mar 2010
• Q: Ongoing effects that affect a card in play persist when the card leaves play, unless something else intervenes (for example, the Tracking rule - see above).
  A: and Tracking rule: Alex Jones, "Kitsune Den and Flight of Doves", 24 Apr 2008
• Q: Can I target a dishonorable dead personality with the action on kitsune den or can it only target personalities currently in play?
  A: No. Comprehensive Rules, Effects: "When an effect begins, it only applies to cards that are either in play, or in a temporary focusing, entering-play, or resolution area, unless: the effect specifies an out of play area, is triggered by a card entering an out of play area (such as, being destroyed or discarded from the hand), or uses wording such as 'all Samurai in and out of play'." Zen Faulkes, "Kitsune Den", 8 Aug 2007
• Q: A Personality or Follower is performing an action if its controller is the player taking the action, and any of these things is true:
  * The action comes from an ability on the Personality or Follower. * The action comes from an ability on an Item or Spell in the Personality’s unit. * The Personality or Follower was targeted by targeting in the ability’s constraints block (between the two colons).
  A: Kitsune Den does not target any Personality in its Constraints Block. All that section contains is "Destroy this card." Martin Lund, "Kanshi v/s Kitsune Den", 31 Jul 2007