Pincers and Tail

Legend of the Five Rings card from Khan's Defiance

Card Type

Item

Force

+2

Chi

+0

Gold Cost

4

Keywords

Weapon

Card Text

Reaction: After a Battle action targeting one of your Personalities resolves, if this card is in your hand: Attach it to him, paying 2 less Gold.
Battle: Bow and destroy this card: Ranged 3 Attack. You may compare this attack's strength against Chi if it targets a Personality.

Focus Value

2

Legality

Age of Enlightenment (Lotus), Race for the Throne (Samurai)

Deck

Fate

Printings

Rules Q&A

• Q: Because somebody is going to follow up and it may as well be me with hyper-legal text: "Concealed Archers: Battle: You may take an additional action to use a Battle ability with a Ranged Attack effect on one of your target cards in an unit not in the current battlefield. Add one to the strength of each of the ability’s Ranged Attacks if the unit’s Personality is Naga. Lose 2 honor." The card targeted by Concealed Archers must be in play when the action of Concealed Archers is played, correct? (If you cannot target a card in a unit not at the current battlefield with a ranged attack, you may not play Concealed Archers, regardless of how many reactions you have to a Battle Action targeting.) For 100% confirmation, you may not use Concealed Archers to trigger a reaction "Attach this item" on any attachment and use that attachment for a ranged attack; you can only use abilities already in play and not at the current battlefield when you choose a target for Concealed Archers. Target-Attach-Use attachment's ranged attack is 100% illegal (In the SE rulesspace) if done via Concealed Archers, correct? You could, theoretically, target a personality with a ranged attack action (Tsuruchi Bob, or Hida Jim's Taoist Archers) with Concealed Archers, then use optional reactions such as Pincer and Tail to equip/attach e.g. Pincer and Tail. You would still be required to use a ranged attack action on the previously targeted card (Tsuruchi Bob, or Hida Jim's Taoist Archers) with a ranged attack prior to the attachment of any optional reaction card like Pincers and Tail (100% unable to use the action ON Pincers and Tail for a Concealed Archers which allowed the attachment of said Pincers and Tail?) and be unable to use any sort of ranged attack action on said attached card (or 100% unable to attach Pincers and Tail if Concealed Archers' target card is Hida Jim's Taoist Archers) for the additional action of Concealed Archers.
  A: Yes, all of that is correct. Brook Cunningham, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 14 Mar 2009
• Q: New questions:
  I was never really clear on this, do atachments grant the personality the ability printed on them, or do atachments use the ability themselves and the personality they're equipped to just perform it?
  Me hoping I'm clearer this time around:
  viewtopic.php?f=59&t=74612
  Nezumi tomarrow seeker wrote: (M)ay I then proceed to use the battle ranged attack on pincers and tail? I am not clear what you mean by "proceed" here. The Battle action is a separate action, not an effect of the Reaction. I thought the Personality was not at the current battlefield, which would make using the ability difficult. Ranged attacks must card cards in the current enemy army, and I don't see how you'll fulfill the Rule of Location (http://rules.l5r.com/Battles#Rule_of_Location).
  I had thought I previously Implied I was using the pincers and tails with concealed archer's effect. I apologize for not making myself clearer. Concealed Archers's relevent text again:
  Battle: You may take an additional action to use a Battle ability with a Ranged Attack effect on one of your target cards in an unit not in the current battlefield.
  Since card effects override the comprehensive rules, I don't need to follow the rule of location for the ranged attack action granted by Concealed Archers. I think?
  The issue with this question (I think) isn't location, it is probably me not understanding how item's actions work with a personality. I had thought they gave the action to the personality, thus I would activate concealed archers, react and equip pincers and tails and then use pincers and tail's battle action as the ranged attack which concealed archers allows me to use, which I previously assumed the personality was granted by the item.
  Nezumi tomarrow seeker wrote: (I)f I have a Pincers and Tail attached to my personality not at the battlefield may i use it's ranged attack ability, thus destroying pincers and Tail, and then equip a pincer and tail to said personality? Not sure how you'll fulfill the Rule of Location.
  Concealed Archers allows me to use that action. (I think) This question was set up in casethe preivious set up didn't work because of some timing issue with me not having the ranged attack before anouncing concealed archer. It assumes, like the above that the personality is granted the action by the item, which is probably wrong.
  this senario would hypothetically go like such: Concealed archers, targing Guy A, destroying Pincers and Tail, reacting to the targeting of guy A with a second pincers and tail.
  A: Do attachments use the ability themselves and the personality they're equipped to just perform it?
  In essence, yes.
  Concealed Archers' relevant text again:
  Battle: You may take an additional action to use a Battle ability with a Ranged Attack effect on one of your target cards in a unit not in the current battlefield.
  Since card effects override the comprehensive rules, I don't need to follow the rule of location for the ranged attack action granted by Concealed Archers.
  Correct. However, you must target a card in play during Required Targetting: "one of your target cards in a unit not in the current battlefield."
  The issue with this question (I think) isn't location, it is probably me not understanding how item's actions work with a personality. I had thought they gave the action to the personality, thus I would activate concealed archers, react and equip pincers and tails and then use pincers and tail's battle action as the ranged attack which concealed archers allows me to use, which I previously assumed the personality was granted by the item.
  No. If you want to use the Battle ability on Pincers and Tail, you must be able to target it before resolving the effects of Concealed Archers, which you can't do because it isn't in play yet. Alex Jones, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 14 Mar 2009
• Q: Concealed Archers: Who is performing this action?
  A: http://rules.l5r.com/FAQ#What_performs_an_action.3F
  "Personalities perform actions printed on them." Does not apply.
  "Followers perform actions printed on them." Does not apply.
  "Action on Items or Spells are performed by their Personality." Does not apply.
  "Personalities and Followers perform actions if they are targeted between the two colons of an action." Does not apply, though the card formatting has changed so it's tricky to tell. The old standard was that things that appeared before "to" were costs.
  "Nobody performs an action if it targets only as an effect (that is, isn't printed between two colons) or doesn't target." This is the only one left. Zen Faulkes, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 13 Mar 2009
• Q: When using the ranged attack on one of your target cards, does this use count for the once per turn rule?
  A: Yes. Zen Faulkes, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 13 Mar 2009
• Q: Pincers and Tail: When I target my personality not at the battlefield may I react with Pincers and Tails and pay 2 gold to give that personality Pincer's and Tail?
  A: Yes. Zen Faulkes, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 13 Mar 2009
• Q: (M)ay I then proceed to use the battle ranged attack on pincers and tail?
  A: I am not clear what you mean by "proceed" here. The Battle action is a separate action, not an effect of the Reaction. I thought the Personality was not at the current battlefield, which would make using the ability difficult. Ranged attacks must card cards in the current enemy army, and I don't see how you'll fulfill the Rule of Location (http://rules.l5r.com/Battles#Rule_of_Location). Zen Faulkes, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 13 Mar 2009
• Q: Hongo uses his battle action. May I react and equip Pincers and Tail using it's reaction?
  A: No. Hongo's ability does not target him. Zen Faulkes, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 13 Mar 2009
• Q: What if I had equipped an attachment from my hand during battle in another manner(?)
  A: Depends on whether it targets the Personality. Zen Faulkes, "Concealed Archers, Pincers and Tail, Battle Equip actions", 13 Mar 2009
• Q: It is my understanding that a Battle open action counts as both a battle and open action.
  A: Not quite. http://rules.l5r.com/Abilities_and_actions#Designators: "An Open/Battle ability creates an action with only one designator, as appropriate to the phase of the game it is announced."
  The action has both designators, but only type of action occurs when you play it. Zen Faulkes, "Pincers and Tail reaction and Battle/Open actions.", 20 Nov 2008
• Q: What if I use Insight, look at the top 3 cards of my deck and then use a Manti's Strenght that was among that cards, after the Manti's Strenght resolves I would attach Pincers and Tail as reaction and then will return the other two cards from Insight that I haven't used to the top of my deck. In this case will I get an extra battle action?
  A: No.
  Insight does not attach a card as one of its effects.
  The Mantis's Strength does not attach a card as one of its effects.
  Pincers and Tail does not attach as a Battle action. Zen Faulkes, "Eastern Hub Port, Pincers and Tail and Insight", 14 Nov 2007
• Q: and proceeds to take first battle action. Player A plays The Mantis's Strength to shoot the opponents personality ZZ. Player A reacts and attaches Pincers and Tail. Then Player A gains the extra action off the box.
  A: No. The action that attached Pincers and Tail was not a Battle action; it was a Reaction.
  When something says, "After an action does this effect," you look only at the printed effect of that action for that effect. You don't get to trawl through all the secondary and tertiary and quaternary effects made possible by Reactions and triggered traits. Zen Faulkes, "Eastern Hub Port and timing", 10 Nov 2007
• Q: Whenever an effect grants an additional action while another action of the same designator is in progress, the timing of the additional action is delayed until after the current action resolves. This makes sure that Battle actions can not occur within other Battle actions, and so on. ["After" ADDED August 14 2007]
  A: So Pincers and Tail and the additional Action from Doomed Intentions both share the same trigger.
  According to the Comprehensive Rules on Timing, the Delayed Effects always come before the Triggered Traits, which always come before Reactions.
  So the Additional Action from Doomed Intentions happens first.
  This might prevent you from ever attaching Pincers and Tail, and consequently stop you from benefiting from Eastern Hub Port too. Martin Lund, "Doomed Intentions and/or Eastern Hub Port Pincers and Tail", 9 Nov 2007
• Q: In this post you indicate that the triggered trait on Eastern Hub Port occurs before the reaction on Gate Guardsman. OK.
  The response to the question: "1b - If my previous question is right and during my next action Gate Guardsman is destroyed he'll never get the chance to react right?" was "Correct"
  This directly conflicts with this post here. According to that post, the Battle action from Eastern Hub Port is a delayed effect. That would allow Gate Guardsman to take his reaction BEFORE the additional action from Eastern Hub Port is actually taken.
  Which is correct?
  A: The most recent ruling is correct until such time as changes are made in the Comprehensive Rules. The current ruling was what we settled on for Gen-Con, and upon further review we haven't had much cause to change things. Martin Lund, "RE:Eastern Hub Port & Pincers and Tail vs Gate Guardsman", 9 Nov 2007
• Q: I declare naval invasion and then use a battle action that targets my personality (ex: The Manti's Strenght) to kill the Ikoma Random ok? Well, then it's time to make reactions. As the active player my first reaction is to attach Pincers and Tail to my Yoritomo Random who have performed the battle action. When I do this what will happen?
  1a - The reaction window is going to be interrupted by my stronghold effect and I will have the chance to take an additional battle action?
  A: Triggered traits on cards are always taken before Reactions, so Eastern Hub Port's triggered trait will resolve before any Reactions to attaching Pincers and Tail can be played - if it were legally triggered in the first place.
  Mantis's Strength does not attach anything, so it won't trigger Eastern Hub Port.
  Pincer's and Tail's Reaction is not a Battle Action, so it won't trigger Eastern Hub Port either. Martin Lund, "Eastern Hub Port & Pincers and Tail vs Gate Guardsman", 9 Nov 2007
• Q: If during my turn my opponent he uses Isawa Ochiai Exp. open ability on my Yoritomo Random. When I declare an attack and assign my personality she will make the duel from her ability that will end up bowing my Yoritomo. Assuming I had Pincers and Tail attached to my personality can I use the item battle action? Based on the "who's performing" rule I guess not. But I had that doubt, so here I am.
  Thanks in advance.
  Pincers and Tail
  Reaction: After a Battle action targeting one of your Personalities resolves, if this card is in your hand: Attach it to him, paying 2 less Gold. Battle: Bow and destroy this card: Ranged 3 Attack. You may compare this attack's strength against the target's Chi instead of Force if he is a Personality.
  [Mod edit: Thread title, typos. -ZF]
  A: Generally, the bowed status of a Personality does not affect whether you can use an ability on an attached card.
  The rule is, "Abilities on a bowed card can not be used," not, "Bowed Personalities can't perform actions." Those are two very different things. Zen Faulkes, "Bowed personality and items.", 2 Oct 2007
• Q: If I control a Yoritomo Random and have a item attached to him (Pincers and Tail for example). During an attack I declare naval invasion and so I can only use an action that targets him or that he performs right? What about Pincers and Tail battle? Is my personality who is performing it? Can I use that battle as my naval action?
  A: The question is, "How do I tell who performs an action?"
  http://rules.l5r.com/Glossary_P-Q#Perform
  I have to make a FAQ entry about performing. Zen Faulkes, "Item and performing", 22 Sep 2007